Air France KLM Group

Jeannot a écrit:Je ne veux pas polémiquer mais n'est il pas vrai que GE a voulu il y un peu mons de deux faire un retour sur le 350 et que Airbus via JL a écarté cette possibilité au nom du principe d'avoir un seul moteur sur toute la gamme ce que ne proposait pas GE ?

• de la motorisation des avions juridiquement commandés en bonne et due forme ;
  
• de l'évolution éventuelle des avions A350-XWB-800 / -900 et -1000 !
  

• 
  Comment GE & / ou P&W pourraient -ils seulement commencer à construire le "business case", sans parler de 'le boucler' / de 'le clore' pour les actuels variantes commandées ?
  
• Qu'est-ce qu'ils pourraient mettre dans le panier, à ce stade, même pour une 'deuxième fournée' des mêmes variantes ? Je ne parle pas des avions A350-XWB, dans des versions au-delà de l'an 2025 , par exemple.
  
• 
  John LEAHY sait qu'il y a un problème à ce niveau, de ce genre ! Th. ENDERS finira par comprendre !
  
• C'est pour cela que John LEAHY avait même évoqué, il n'y a pas longtemps, la possibilité d'accorder à RR une exclusivité "de iuré sur tout le programme A350-XWB. Personne d'autre de chez EADS / Airbus ne s'est prononcé à ce sujet.
  
• 
  Je ne révélerai pas avant longtemps la position de RR sur cette "proposition" ou "évocation de proposition" !
  Et nous ne pouvons pas empêcher les media de raconter leurs fictions ou autres bobards sur ce (genre de) sujet !
  

Aspen a écrit:Dans le meilleur des mondes :

Les seules questions à trouver de bonnes réponses :

Quel est le module précisément dont AF et KLM ont besoin ?

Aspen a écrit:A quelle date ?

• de reserrement de l'offre, au travers d'une inter-pénétration et avec un meilleur partage ou "commonality" / "communauté" des itinéraires,
  
• tenant compte des besoins & souhaits des clients,
  
• lesquels le 'partenariat' AF-KLM, comme composante de l'Alliance SKY TEAM (dimension à ne pas négliger ! ) arrive à couvrir de manière plus 'harmonisée' (mot que je déteste) ou plus 'rapprochée' (vocable que j'affectionne), ......
  
• pour un meilleur 'confort' des clients & passagers, et un meilleur résultat financier, destinée à faire évoluer la flotte et sa gestion (ce qui implique le besoin impératif d'éviter au maximum !la tare de 'faire voler des avions vides', objectif qui, lui repose sur la bonne utilisation, à bon escient, des toutes les techniques de "Yield Management", ..... ce qui implique des approches souples, à évolution constante, frappée d'une évolution permanente, .... aspect qui touche tous les êtres humains de l'Entreprise, soit les Cies. aériennes, selon les meilleurs pratiques d'ERP : "Enterprise Resource Planning") !
  
  

Aspen a écrit:A quel prix ?

Aspen a écrit:Comme chez Lufthansa, AF/ KLM a ses propres filiales maintenances / suivis de flottes ( ramp & checks ).

Aspen a écrit:Certains, peu, ont fait remarquer que DLH a fait le choix de l'A 340-600 alors qu'AF-KLM choisissait le B 777. Il a quelques années.

Aspen a écrit:L'offre de LHT est assez large, même si la base installée Trent 550/560 est moins importante que celle des GE 90.

Aspen a écrit:Pourquoi AF-KLM aurait choisi le B 787 ?

Aspen a écrit:Ni l'A 350XWB, ni le B 787 ne sont certifiés.

Aspen a écrit:Alors quels risques pèsent sur chacun des programmes ?

Aspen a écrit:Si ces risques existent, quels rapports avec les moteurs ?

Voir ci-après !

• le 787-8 était prévu pour remplacer le 767
  
• le 787-9 était prévu pour remplacer le 777-200
  
• le 787-10 était... pour remplacer le 777-300
  

Jeannot a écrit:Je ne suis pas certain que, si demande d'AF/KLM i l y a eu, elle se serait pas limitée, du moins dans un premier temps, à réaliser soi-même l'entretien de ses propres appareils et ainsi d'éviter à devoir le faire réaliser par des filiales de compagnies que le groupe pourrait considérer comme des concurrents majeurs. Bien sur cette démarche demanderait alors un investissement en formation et sans doute équipements.

• "OK ! Au lieu de vous faire des rabais de 85% au moment de l'achat de vos moteurs, on va vous facturer les 50 "ship-sets" à US$ 50 millions par ship-set, moins 20% de rabais, "cash at front end", pour tenir compte de votre volonté de former une JV avec nous, comme nous et nos autres partenaires avons pu faire dans le passé! Aussi, vous signerez un accord TotalCare de 10 ans, ..... "cash paid at front end", dans des conditions de 50% du tarif normal, pour vous être agréable et vous permettre de financer les équipements de base qui seront nécessaires. Ensuite, on 'roulera' au coup par coup, pour les choses exceptionnelles, avec , par exemple, pour les chioses routinières, chaque année, un GRA ("General Relations Agreement") des accords dits de RDA / RTA ("Research & Development Assessment" / "Research & Technology Assessment") .... selon des coéfficients et assiettes de calcul à déterminer d'un commun accord. En contre-partie, on vous transfère la technologie, de manière permanente, les évolutions et mises-à-jour des éléments "State of the Art", pour que notre JV soit "au top" dans le MRO, avec les autres JV que nous avons montées et développées avec nos autres partenaiores traditionnels ! ", .......
  

Jeannot a écrit:il est probable qu'AF/KLM aurait souhaité pouvoir offrir un service aux compagnies qui le souhaiteraient et qui préfèreraient travailler avec le groupe. La question des pénalités perdrait alors tout son sens.

Jeannot a écrit:Mais toute cette discussion s'appuie sur une hypothèse (la demande d'AF/KLM) dont nous ne savons pas si elle est fondée ou appartient au domaine des élucubrations de journalistes. Alors...

A hangar the size of two football pitches is rising at Manila airport as the Philippines bids to become one of the world's select few pit stops for the Airbus A380, the world's biggest commercial jet.

2011 AFP

MANILA — A hangar the size of two football pitches is rising at Manila airport as the Philippines bids to become one of the world's select few pit stops for the Airbus A380, the world's biggest commercial jet.

Lufthansa Technik Philippines is building the $30 million hangar, its third at the airport, to accommodate the new trend of larger aircraft, said its sales and marketing vice-president Dominik Wiener-Silva.
"What we're going to see is an increase in the average size of aircraft," he told AFP during a recent interview, adding that the industry overall was on an upswing after a difficult period.

The German firm hopes to cash in on the small group of carriers that have made the first 60 orders for the 275-tonne behemoths but lack their own maintenance facilities.

Only four sites worldwide can currently service the massive jet, which has a wing span of nearly 80 metres (262 feet).
"The Airbus 380 is a very large aircraft but it's not an unusually large aircraft," Wiener-Silva said. "The new hangar will be A380-capable. It will be large enough to have the largest aircraft in the world."
Set to be completed early next year, the new facility ramps up Lufthansa's capital investment in the Philippines to about $130 million, he added.

The core business of Lufthansa's Philippine unit is heavy maintenance.Once every five or six years, jets are grounded for 25 days and are stripped to bare metal to get all their many thousands of individual parts tested for safety.
Britain's Virgin Atlantic is its biggest customer, along with the likes of the long-haul budget carrier Air Asia X, Cathay Pacific, Etihad, Japan Airlines, Korean Air, Qantas and Saudi Airlines.

Twenty other airlines also have their line maintenance at Lufthansa's expanding Manila base for Airbus aircraft as well as the ATR 72-500, the short-haul turboprop favoured by many budget airlines.
Line maintenance is a lighter, 24-hour safety check that regulators require once every 18 months.
Lufthansa offers other types of services at its 30-plus units around the world, including one in southern China that specialises in thrust reversers and other composite-material components.
"After some very difficult years in 2009 and 2010 we certainly see signs of an upturn," Wiener-Silva said.
"Airlines, especially in Asia, are picking up fast. We're actually seeing the strongest growth worldwide in the Middle East and Asia."
Aircraft maintenance accounts for about 10-12 percent of airline operating costs, and the local unit, the largest majority-owned Lufthansa unit outside Germany, has tidy revenues of about $200 million yearly, said Wiener-Silva.

But the 2,700-strong workforce -- almost all of whom are Filipinos -- is what makes the firm stand out, he said.
"In aircraft maintenance you will always encounter the unpredictable. It's not a standard production process and if you look for defects you require solutions," Wiener-Silva said.
"Filipinos are really passionate about finding the solution, getting the aircraft fixed and making the customer happy."
Wiener-Silva said the Philippines was unique in the region for its English-speaking population and extensive network of aviation schools that supply Lufthansa's local workforce.

"That is different from other up-and-coming countries like India and China -- you won't find that infrastructure," he said.
New graduates who go to work for Lufthansa Technik are put through the in-house training school, where they undergo a further 1.5 years of hands-on training before they are entrusted with the multi-million-dollar planes.

The unit sees new business in cabin modification, both for full-service carriers, which are keen on issues such as improving cabin amenities, as well as low-cost operators seeking to improve efficiency, said Wiener-Silva.
"Even a mechanic needs to be able to differentiate between a full-service carrier, where the cabin is the important part of the product... and low-cost carriers, some of which don't even have carpets in their cabins anymore."

French parliamentarians have launched a petition calling on Air France-KLM to place a USD$20 billion - USD$25 billion plane order with Airbus and not Boeing -- but airline officials said they would split the order.

Bernard Carayon, a member of President Nicolas Sarkozy's ruling conservative UMP party, who claims authorship of the popular term "economic patriotism" to defend French firms, said he had collected signatures from 102 members of parliament.

"When the Americans buy American, Europeans should buy European," said Carayon, whose list of signatories amounts to more than one in six members of the lower National Assembly.

Mais .... ! ?

Air France-KLM is negotiating with Boeing and Airbus and their engine makers after launching a tender for 100 mid-sized Airbus A350 or Boeing 787 jets to renew its long-haul fleet.

The order for the latest carbon-composite aircraft is seen as one of the biggest industry battles in the coming year.
Airline officials said the contract would be designed according to the needs of the group's two main networks and would probably be split between Boeing and Airbus.

"My view is that at some point in the future, both types of aircraft will be flying on both of our networks," Peter Hartman, chief executive of Dutch carrier KLM said.

Air France and KLM merged in 2004 to form Europe's largest airline by revenues but they kept separate networks and brands.

Historically, KLM has tended to buy Boeing aircraft and Air France has a mixed fleet with emphasis on Boeing for long trips.
Asked whether the Air France-KLM group would miss out on the best price by stating in advance that it was ready to split the order, Hartman said: "Half of 100 is still a lot of planes."

A final decision is not expected for several months.

Carayon's intervention is unlikely to have an immediate impact on the negotiations but is seen as an early warning of the potentially volatile backdrop to the deal as employment once again looks set to dominate French elections due in 2012.

Certainss disent que Bernard CARAYON et le France auraient plus d'impact dans ce genre d'exercice, s'ils décidaient de se montrer plus "européens", et de parler davantage des intérêts des acteurs de l'UE, plutôt que de ceux de la France, seule !

Aerospace is a major source of high-tech jobs in France.

Aircraft industry executives say plane orders such as this one tend to trigger intense lobbying from both sides of the Atlantic, often dragging in the heads of respective governments.

The contest is also happening as the United States and European Union draw towards the close of the world's largest trade battle involving mutual allegations of aircraft subsidies.

Any sign of interference in the Air France-KLM deal will likely be seized on by Boeing as evidence of unfair competition.

The French government owns 15.7 percent of Air France-KLM and 15 percent of Airbus parent company EADS.
Airbus and Boeing are the world's only manufacturers of aircraft in the 250-300 seat class targeted by Air France-KLM. They face the threat of new competition from China, Canada, Russia and Brazil for their best-selling smaller models.
Airbus has sold 2,894 planes to North America in its 40-year history, according to data on the company's website. Over the same period, Boeing has sold 4,100 planes to Europe including to Air France and traditional Boeing buyer British Airways.

(Reuters)

Que pensent nos Forumistes de ce genre de "patriotisme économique" ? [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir cette image]

Jeannot a écrit:Pour être complet il faut aussi dire qua BA a aussi pris du 787. Non ?

• A318 : 2 (moteurs : CFM-56) ;
  
• A319 : 33 (moteurs : tous IAE V2500) ;
  
• A320 : 44 (moteurs : 40 x IAE V2500 ; 4 x CFM-56, "héritage" A320-100 de B-CAL) ;
  
• A321 : 11 (moteurs : tous IAE V2500).
  

• que ces +++=== visitent le site RR, sous le lien :
  
• [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]
  

On se rend bien compte à quel point ces investissements et leur financement peuvent s'avérer onéreux, surtout pendant la période (longue) de montée en puissance de l'activité MRO, en tant qu'activité nouvelle !

• AF-KLM choisira l'A350-XWB d'Airbus.
  
• Et il n'est pas impossible , dans la chronologie des événements, qu'il puisse faire ce choix, en donnant toutes les précisions d'usage (dans ce genre d'opération) avant de se déterminer sur une quelconque commande de B787 .
  
• Jusqu'à nouvel ordre, AF-KLM sera obligé de prendre la motorisation RR.
  
• C'est RR, et ni Airbus, ni le Gouvernement français, ni le Gouvernement britannique, ni l'UE, ni la Cour Européenne de Justice -- aucune de ces parties ; aucune -- qui déterminera le principe et l'architecture de base de la relation conractuelle entre AF et RR, sur une quelconque composante de cette relation contractuelle, et ce, notamment, dans le contexte de l'activité MRO-Moteurs !
  

Nos Forumistes ont des connaissances bien plus détaillées, plus poussées, et des informations bien plus profondes sur ces aspects, que les détails que l'on trouve dans les media.

• avec son historique de Société d'Etat,
  
• et la masse critique de personnes au sein de la Société qui est toujours frappée d'une mentalité d'une Administration, ..... de "fonctionnaires dans le Privé" (rien d'étonnant ; British Aieways est passé par là), .......
  

Cela n'est pas forcément mon avis ! C'est une perception très largement répandue. C'est à AF de la gommer, ... pas aux autres !

Contract includes long-term TotalCarea maintenance agreement

Virgin Atlantic, one of the world’s leading long-haul airlines, today announced it has selected Rolls-Royce Trent 700 engines to power its new Airbus fleet of 10 A330-300s. The aircraft are due for delivery from early 2011.

The order, worth $720m, includes 10 sets of installed engines and three spare engines. To ensure that the engines remain at peak performance the contract also includes a long-term maintenance agreement.

Steve Ridgway, chief executive for Virgin Atlantic, commented; “Our Rolls Royce engine order signals our commitment to flying a modern fleet with the most fuel efficient technology available. Now is the right time for leading businesses to be placing orders like this so that companies, vital to the British economy, can protect jobs, grow and thrive in the future.”

The Trent 700 is the first engine in the highly successful Trent family. The 72,000lb thrust engine*** has lower maintenance costs, lower weight and better performance retention. With the lowest lifecycle fuel burn, lowest cumulative emissions and lowest noise levels the Trent 700 has the lowest environmental impact of any engine on the A330.

Mark King Rolls-Royce President – Civil Aerospace, said: "This order continues a long and successful relationship and we are pleased that Virgin Atlantic is again turning to Trent engine technology. We remain committed to delivering competitive advantage and fuel-efficient power to support their environmental, operational and economic requirements.”

In June 2009 Virgin Atlantic placed a $2.1bn order for 10 new Airbus A330-300 aircraft.
Five aircraft will arrive in 2011 and five in 2012. The twin-engine plane, which can seat up to 270 passengers, will operate on many of Virgin Atlantic’s existing business and leisure routes worldwide and will assist future growth before the arrival of the Boeing 787 Dreamliners in 2013. The A330 aircraft is nearly 10% more fuel efficient than the A340-300 aircraft as well as delivering lower maintenance costs****** and substantial cargo capacity.

Each of the A330-300 aircraft will feature the next generation of seats, which will be lighter and even more comfortable than those in the air today. Every passenger will benefit from a dynamic new entertainment hub, including USB ports and power sockets in Upper Class and Premium Economy cabins, which will set the new standard in in-flight systems. All passengers will also be able to send and receive emails and texts on their mobile devices. Virgin Atlantic will be the first UK long-haul airline to roll-out this service across its fleet.

Virgin Atlantic has a fleet of 38 aircraft – 19 A340-600s, 6 A340-300s and 13 B747-400s. Rolls- Royce currently supplies Virgin Atlantic with the engines on its A340-600 fleet and has been selected to supply engines for its 15 787s which are currently on order.

• son manque de connaissances et de compréhension sur ce type de sujet,
  
• son aveuglement, dû à son parti-pris puérile et stérile, et sa mauvaise foi !
  

Il faut professionnaliser les arguments.

Air France-KLM has won assurances from a senior French minister that it will be allowed to make its own “independent” choice about whether to spend tens of billions of dollars buying new passenger jets from Airbus or Boeing.

The Franco-Dutch airline has in the past week come under increasing pressure from French lawmakers, and at least one minister, to place an entire order for 100 new long-range aircraft – one of the biggest anticipated purchases in the industry – with Europe’s Airbus rather than Boeing of the US.

The campaign, which has won the backing of almost 150 legislators, has tapped into resurgent public support in France for “economic patriotism”. French lawmakers are still angry about a multibillion-dollar US contract for a fleet of air refuelling tankers, which was originally handed to Toulouse-based Airbus before being taken away and awarded instead to Boeing.

But on Wednesday, François Baroin, the French budget minister and ally of Nicolas Sarkozy, the country’s president, stepped into the dispute to stress that the government and the company were required to abide by global free trade rules.

“We are in a state of law with European rules and global rules with the [World Trade Organisation],” Mr Baroin said. However, he added that the French government would remain “attentive” to the new order.

His comments came on the same day that Henri Gourgeon, the Air France-KLM chief executive, was called into a meeting with Pierre Lellouche, a French export minister, to “explain” what was going on with the order.

Mr Lellouche had indicated on Tuesday that the French state was looking for something in return for the strong support it has offered to the airline in the past. The French government is the airline’s biggest single shareholder with a stake of 15.7 per cent.

Air France-KLM welcomed the intervention by Mr Baroin on Wednesday. Company insiders said they hoped to get on with making a decision based on technical merit, rather than national pressure.

A company spokesman said the Dutch partners in the airline were also eager for an “independent” decision on the purchase, which will be the first large joint order since Air France and KLM of the Netherlands merged in 2004.

.......
Company officials have been examining the rival merits of Boeing’s 787 Dreamliner and Airbus A350 for about a year, and will base the decision on factors such as fuel economy and delivery dates. Analysts expect the order to be divided between the two suppliers.

Bernard Carayon, a member of Mr Sarkozy’s ruling conservative UMP party, who is leading the parliamentary campaign, has said: “When the Americans buy American, Europeans should buy European.”

Is the French government turning into one of those activist investors it so despises and accuses of pursuing their own short-term interests at the cost of a company’s long-term development?

Take Pierre Lellouche, French trade minister. On the eve of the Paris Air Show, he summoned Pierre-Henri Gourgeon, chief executive of [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien], to justify his purchasing intentions regarding the carrier’s forthcoming [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]

It is true the government has a 15 per cent stake in the French flag-carrier. But can anyone imagine long-term institutional investors such as Fidelity meddling in the purchasing intentions of one of their investments? Such behaviour smacks more of the aggressive [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] who have been agitating for a shake-up at well-established companies for the past few years, much to the irritation of management and other long-term stakeholders, not to mention politicians.

It is not the first time the French government has attempted to dictate policy to companies in which it holds a stake. Indeed, it has also been doing this with companies in which it has no shareholding, such as [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]. The car group’s chief executive Philippe Varin was summoned the other day by Eric Besson, the industry minister, to explain his intentions over the apparently endangered future of the large Citroën plant at Aulnay, just down the road from the air show at Le Bourget.

Such political interference is part and parcel of doing business in France.

It has been so since the days of Colbert in the 17th century. But Louis XIV’s finance minister had a long-term vision for the country’s economic independence and well-being, whereas it is somewhat questionable whether today’s so-called industrial policy has the same goals.

In recent weeks, the number of public statements and government interventions seems to be increasing. And you cannot help feeling that this has everything to do with the approach of [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] and little to do with industrial policy.

But this latest outburst of what has become known as “[Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]” risks ultimately damaging the interests it is seeking to protect.

After all, Air France is a commercial company whose welfare depends on getting the best products at the best price to offer the best service to its customers.

Indeed, Paris itself seems to have belatedly realised this with François Baroin, the budget minister, later conceding that Air France would be allowed to make its own, independent decision. Nonetheless, he said Paris would remain attentive to the aircraft order.

By putting pressure on the airline to buy aircraft from Airbus rather than its US rival [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien], Paris is giving the European aircraft manufacturer the upper hand in what should be an open and competitive tender. In reality, Air France will never just buy Boeing or Airbus. No carrier wants to be solely dependent on one supplier. Even [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien], which for years bought Boeing almost exclusively, eventually diversified with Airbus purchases. In the end, market logic suggests you must be able to play one supplier off against the other.

Of course, the Europeans and especially the French will argue that the Americans displayed extraordinary protectionism in the recent [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]. Airbus originally secured the contract, but political interference saw the whole deal turned on its head and eventually going to Boeing. But there is an obvious difference between commercial and military contracts.

When the military buys, it is to all intents and purpose the government that is the purchaser. The government can argue the need for a national rather than a foreign supplier in such highly sensitive areas as defence. The French do the same in backing the [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] Rafale combat plane versus the European Typhoon, let alone US-built aircraft.
Moreover, the political meddling over the Air France purchase seems even more unjustified given that the airline never asked for a penny of state aid during the latest crisis, unlike the carmakers.

Whether it likes it or not, Paris should also remember that civil aircraft makers on both sides of the Atlantic today operate global production lines. Even if Airbus does clinch the Air France deal, the American suppliers would still stand to benefit significantly given that about 60 per cent of the value of an Airbus aircraft these days is made up of US components, engines and avionics included.

But the politicians do not seem to care about value. They essentially care about protecting jobs for the aircraft industry in Toulouse and for the car industry around Paris and in Normandy, especially in an election year. In that respect, at least, they are very different from the stereotypical short-term activist investor.
Paul Betts is the FT’s senior correspondent in Paris

Le directeur général de la compagne aérienne Air France-KLM, Pierre-Henri Gourgeon, a indiqué jeudi à Washington que l'Etat français souhaitait seulement être tenu au courant du processus de la commande d'avions long-courrier qu'il a en préparation.


© 2011 AFP

Ne pas oublier que l'impression reçue est à motié donnée (et ça vaut pour nous tous ; la différence entre les uns et les autres, sur cette question, est que certains ne l'acceptent pas ! Nous les connaissons ! Devinez ! ).

Le renouvellement de Pierre-Henri Gourgeon à la direction générale d'Air France-KLM devrait être approuvé lors de l'assemblée générale des actionnaires, le 7 juillet prochain, mais des voix devraient s'élever. Selon La Tribune, le représentant des pilotes au conseil d'administration du groupe, Bernard Pédamon, a voté contre un renouvellement du mandat pour quatre ans.

"Son deuxième mandat à la tête d'Air France-KLM devrait se concevoir comme un mandat de transition, qui prépare la succession mais qui ne devrait pas excéder deux ans", a déclaré Bernard Pédamon, confirmant des informations de Libération parues en avril dernier.

Encore un pilote, ou représentant des pilotes, qui veut jouer au Management ?! N'est pas Willie WALSH qui veut !

Exception culturelle ? Encore !?

Bernard Pédamon plaide pour "un recrutement interne sans s'interdire l'arrivée de compétences extérieures", poursuit le quotidien, qui ajoute que Bruno Matheu, l'un des trois directeurs généraux délégués d'Air France-KLM, est considéré comme le grand favori dans le cas d'une succession en interne.

Je ne fais que réagir, à ma façon, contre une proposition théoriquement de Top Management, qui est visiblement plus près des bas niveaux que des sommets managériaux visés par les Responsables d'AF-KLM !

Air France Insists on Repair Rights in Airbus-Boeing Contest

[Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] Group, weighing [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]’s 787 against the Airbus SAS 350 for a 100-plane order, said it will insist on offering its own maintenance services for the aircraft and engine models it purchases.
Overhaul and support rights for the Air France Industries division is “a subject discussed” with manufacturers including Rolls-Royce Holdings Plc, Boeing and Airbus, Chief Executive Officer Pierre-Henri Gourgeon said in an interview.
“We insist upon and will get what we need to remain a significant player in this business,” he said in [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien].
Rolls-Royce, the sole A350 engine-maker, is refusing to allow Air France to offer maintenance to other airlines, two people said last month, declining to be identified because the talks are confidential. The $20 billion plane purchase being prepared by Air France may include both the Airbus and Boeing 787s equipped with [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] turbines, they said.
[Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]’s biggest airline is seeking to expand its [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] unit, one of a dwindling number of in-house service shops that compete with the plane and engine makers for repair work. The strategy is at odds with the latest Boeing and Airbus aircraft programs, which promised suppliers more after- sales profit in return for bigger upfront investments.
Rolls-Royce spokesman Richard Hedges said the company had no comment and GE didn’t immediately return calls for comment.
Rolls is balking at Air France’s request to allow it to overhaul Trent engines as part of a deal for the Airbus plane, the people said last month. The enginemaker’s position may shift plans at Air France to divide the purchase of about 100 long- range jets between the 787 and A350, they said.

GE Willing
The French airline doesn’t currently service any Rolls- Royce turbines. Its fleet is equipped solely with engines from GE or the U.S. company’s joint ventures with [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] and United Technologies Corp.’s Pratt & Whitney, according to data from aviation research firm Ascend.
GE, which lets Air France Industries service its existing models, is more willing to extend that right to the 787’s GEnx engines, the people also said. The mid-sized Boeing plane is due to enter service around September, two years before the A350.
Air France Industries, like the maintenance units of Deutsche Lufthansa AG and [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien], counts on revenue from servicing other carriers to help cover costs. Other airlines accounted for one-third of maintenance business last year, when revenue at the division grew 8 percent.
Among aerospace suppliers, enginemakers have the most to gain from service revenues because jet turbines need more frequent maintenance and part replacements than airframes. The share of the Rolls-Royce engine fleet covered by its TotalCare maintenance contracts rose to 76 percent last year from 55 percent in 2007, according to the company’s annual reports.

Jeannot a écrit:Où on revient à la case départ.

Air France Insists on Repair Rights in Airbus-Boeing Contest

[Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] Group, weighing [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien]’s 787 against the Airbus SAS 350 for a 100-plane order, said it will insist on offering its own maintenance services for the aircraft and engine models it purchases.

Overhaul and support rights for the Air France Industries division is “a subject discussed” with manufacturers including Rolls-Royce Holdings Plc, Boeing and Airbus, Chief Executive Officer Pierre-Henri Gourgeon said in an interview.
“We insist upon and will get what we need to remain a significant player in this business,” he said in [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien].

Rolls-Royce, the sole A350 engine-maker, ......

...........is refusing to allow Air France to offer maintenance to other airlines, two people said last month, declining to be identified because the talks are confidential.

The $20 billion plane purchase being prepared by Air France may include both the Airbus and Boeing 787s equipped with [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] turbines, they said.

Europe’s biggest airline

i........s seeking to expand its [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] unit, one of a dwindling number of in-house service shops that compete with the plane and engine makers for repair work. The strategy is at odds with the latest Boeing and Airbus aircraft programs, which promised suppliers more after- sales profit in return for bigger upfront investments.

Rolls-Royce spokesman Richard Hedges said the company had no comment and GE didn’t immediately return calls for comment.

Rolls is balking at Air France’s request to allow it to overhaul Trent engines as part of a deal for the Airbus plane, the people said last month. The enginemaker’s position may shift plans at Air France to divide the purchase of about 100 long- range jets between the 787 and A350, they said.

GE Willing

The French airline doesn’t currently service any Rolls- Royce turbines. Its fleet is equipped solely with engines from GE or the U.S. company’s joint ventures with [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien] and United Technologies Corp.’s Pratt & Whitney, according to data from aviation research firm Ascend.

GE, which lets Air France Industries service its existing models, is more willing to extend that right to the 787’s GEnx engines, the people also said. The mid-sized Boeing plane is due to enter service around September, two years before the A350.

Air France Industries, like the maintenance units of Deutsche Lufthansa AG and [Vous devez être inscrit et connecté pour voir ce lien], counts on revenue from servicing other carriers to help cover costs. Other airlines accounted for one-third of maintenance business last year, when revenue at the division grew 8 percent.
Among aerospace suppliers, enginemakers have the most to gain from service revenues because jet turbines need more frequent maintenance and part replacements than airframes. The share of the Rolls-Royce engine fleet covered by its TotalCare maintenance contracts rose to 76 percent last year from 55 percent in 2007, according to the company’s annual reports.

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